Here's a little food for thought for those of you engaging in the illegal immigration debate.
First, an article pointing out the hypocrisy in Mexico's position on illegal immigration. (It is a PDF)
Second, a copy of the Mexican Constitution, translated into English.
Update 4/9/06: Larry Elders' column of 4/6/06. Charles Krauthammer's column of 4/8/06.
8 comments:
Ok so this is another case that shows that we as a country are morally superior. What is your arguement? Mexico sold their soul so should we?
No. I have two arguements.
1)Everytime President Fox of Mexico stands up and condemns the cruel racist policies of the US, an American official should laugh in his face, hand him a copy of the Mexican Constitution, and tell him to shut up.
2) When Congress comes back in two weeks, they should scrap all the work they have done so far, pull out all the relevant passages of the Mexican Constitution, and start a new bill from them. I don't care if every single bit of the Mexican Constiution is eventually removed from the bill, but I want the symbol of using it as a starting point.
We are currently selling the soul of our country, all in the name of cheap vegetables and cheap labor. We are first of all a nation of laws, above all else.
How Mexico or President Fox treats illegals is not relevant. Just as it's not relevant how their health care system is set up. Or how their tax structure is set up. Or anything about their government.
I have never understood the argument that "Well they do so I guess it makes it ok for us to do it" Wrong. Mexico handing out flyers on how to best get into this country is something we need to take up with Mexico.
On another note. What will the cost of A wall, maintaining a wall, rounding up 15 million people rolling them through court, loading them in buses, planes, box cars or what ever. Dealing with the increased cost in the various industries that will have an increase in wages...as well as 15 million people will not go quietly. I just don't see why we should look to Europe for our immigration ideas. Am I happy that I have to pay for illegals? No. I just don't think the alternatives will cost me less.
1) Well some of us are a little tired of Mr "holier-than-thou" Fox condemning us for the way we treat our illegals, especially considering how hypocritical he is.
2) Currently over $16.5 billion a year is sent to Mexico, the vast majority of it by illegal aliens, and the vast majority of it produced on the untaxed, underground economy. The numbers of the first part of this year continue to go up. If even half of this money is retained and reinvested/spent in the US economy, it would have a significant impact, especially in highly impacted communities in the Southwest. This alone would pay for the construction of a secure border. This is before we start factoring in the amount of money we will save in taxes used to support illegals and their families which is also in the billions.
3) If we build a secure wall, and also actually enforce the labor laws on the books we will not need to round up the illegals, most of them will deport themselves when they cannot get a job. These jobs will be filled by Americans, at appropriate wages.
4) 10% of the cost of fresh vegetables is derived from labor costs. Even if we have to double the current pay (to something approaching $20 an hour in most places) that would mean that $1.00 of vegetables today would cost $1.10 instead. Most Americans are willing to spend that extra dime. The effect would be comparable in other sectors. There is no job sector in which illegals comprise the majority of workers.
5) The amnesty in 1986 was supposed to be the "last" amnesty. At that time we legalized less than 3 million illegals. This time we legalize 12 million. How many more will be here in twenty years?
6) Mexico is never going to reform as long as we have a porous border. They ship their poor North, so they don't have to provide for them, and get the bonus of billions of dollars of foriegn income (currently second highest source, soon to be the highest even more than oil). The corrupt ruling class will go merrily sailing along as long as we allow them to. Perhaps if those hundreds of thousands of illegals who are marching through our streets, demanding that we support them with our taxes, were marching through the streets of Mexico City instead, things would change.
1.) I don't care what Fox has to say. He can't rule his own country, thus the problem, so he has nothing to add.
2.)I have to think about the $16.5B statement. Maybe I need to take financial advice from an illegal if every man woman and child can average $100 a month to send to Mexico all on less than min wage.
3.) Oh I love this one. "If we cut off education, medical and earming ability they will leave." Um no. They will riot. They will become terrorist. You really think 15 billion people will all just say "good game" and leave? When in the past has that happened? Where is the world is this working?
4.) So people will pay more so they don't have to pay more? This is my problem it just sounds like throwing good money after bad.
5&6.)I don't know. Maybe if enough people come from Mexico no one will be home and I can go in and claim it for myself. I do understand that at some point the people of Mexico have to do something before half of their people live in the U.S. Maybe we should go at it from the other end? Say to Fox look control your people any more the X number of people come over our border we will consider it A.)invasion B.)Mass refugees C.)A government that is no longer valid. and the bottom line which ever you pick results in us annexing Mexico. They do have 1.)Oil 2.)Nice beaches 3.)A much smaller Border in the south. If I have to pay for these people I want something for it.
Again am I happy I had to pay $1200 more than I recieved in taxes last year? No I just don't think that at the end of the day I'll have a net savings of $1200. Be it increase food costs. Increased lawn care costs. Increased taxes for law enforcement to police the percent of the 15 million who will turn to crime.
I just don't see how this is any different than the last 200 years of people saying the same thing in this country. When your the best people want to be with you. Is it really that bad that we have to pick up the tab on 5% of the population? We aren't wasting more money on corporate grants(welfare?) Or hell regular welfare?
1) The numbers I'm using are official Mexican and US government numbers. They're easy to track, because most of the money is sent electronically. Remember, most of them aren't paying taxes, so it's easier for them to get that extra $100, and people are sadly mistaken about just how cheap that labor is. The average migrant farmworker is making more than $10 an hour now. Plus many of us believe the 11 to 12 million number is pretty low.
2) Most of the illegals are here for the jobs. They go back to Mexico on vacation, their famlies live in Mexico, they consider themselves Mexican. If the jobs aren't here, they won't be.
3)Last time we legalized 3 million and got at least 12 million more illegals. This time we legalize 12 million. How many more will we have in 20 years? How many is too many?
4) This issue is not primarily a fiscal issue for me. It is a social, legal, moral and security issue for me. We are fortunate that ourr economy can easily accomodate the problems of illegal immigration. Sadly, after the last forty years of multiculturalism, moral relativism and pure anti-Americanism I don't know if our culture can. Especially when a majority of the illegals openly assert their intention to impose their culture on us, and have no intention of assimilating.
It's funny that you bring up morals. I find that our treatment of illegal immigrates shows our moral superiority. It's easy for a country like Mexico to tell a non-Mexican that if they don't have money that they can't have health care but it's hard to say come on in.
Part of my problem is to many say that Illegals are the problem. No the are a symptom of a problem. Illegals from Mexico coming over are a symptom of a broken Mexico. Illegals didn't break our health care system it exacerbates it. Getting rid of illegals wont fix it. Illegals didn't break our educational system they exacerbates it. Again them not being here wont fix it.
I just feel that we are mixing issues.
The issue of assimilation is different from the last 200 years how? They said the same thing about the Irish, Germans, Catholics, Italians shall I continue?
1)The moral thing to do would be to cut off illegal immigration, and the billions of dollars it produces that prop up the corrupt regime in Mexico City. Mexico is addicted to illegal immigration, and it is time to show some tough love.
2)I disagree with you and your opinions about health care and education. But these are minor, side issues.
3)You'll have to remind me of when the Germans marched down main street and demanded rights and claimed entitlements. I don't remember Irish claiming parts of the US belonged to Ireland. When did the Italiens demand that official US documents be printed in Italien, and special bi-lingual Italien classes in school. Where are the German, Italien and Irish language television and radio stations?
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